89 replies to this topic

[DanteAmor]

First a disclaimer... I don't claim to be an expert on this subject by any means.

In fact, I'm a fairly new user and had to pick up most of these details through trial and error, a good number of bans myself, and finally through conversations with a few generous power users.

I finally got tired of typing the same thing over and over again so I pasted the following into my user info earlier today, and have already gotten messages from new users thanking me.

Feel free to add other tips and comments that could be helpful, and perhaps the admin will thumbtack this so we can all just link people to it when they need a clue.

----------------------

Newbie Guide to Soulseek Etiquette

So here's the deal if you want to keep from being banned by others...

1) Only download 1-2 albums at a time from each user, and always read user info. Some people have quirky rules. 1 album (or 10 individual files) is pretty much always safe, two is fine with most but not all, and if you want more than that be sure to ask first.

2) Keep your folder organized. Take note of how other users with big folders do this and copy the style that makes the most sense for you. Many will ban just for having disorganized shares. Doesn't matter how small your folder is now, start organizing right from the start. You'll be amazed at how quickly it can get out of control.

3) Especially when you're new and under 1000 files, add *everything* you download to your share folder and update right away as soon as the d'ls complete. The sooner you get to 3-500 files, the sooner you'll stop seeing "banned" coming up.

4) Even if you only want to add a few songs to your player, keep the full album in your shares. Most people only want complete albums.

5) Don't ask people to start your download. It's not fair to those that have been waiting even longer than you, and some will ban just for that. If you can't stand waiting, support soulseek and drop a measly 5 bucks for privileges.

6) Don't delete the extra files like .nfo, .sfv, and album art. Even if you don't use them, many serious users are only looking for folders that are complete with these. (they allow users to identify and confirm the quality of a download)

7) Avoid sharing your iTunes folder. iTunes renames and changes the tags of your files which really pisses off a lot of serious traders. Better to keep a separate share folder and then import to iTunes from there. This maintains the integrity of the original files and folders.

8) The best way to build up your folder in the beginning without getting banned is to simply ask first. Let people know you're new, and that you'll be adding everything to your shares as soon as you've finished downloading. Many will be generous and helpful as long as you're sincere and can show you're not just a "leech".

9) Lastly, get into the habit of adding every person you download from to your user list. Before you know it you may find that people are piling up in your queue and you're having to consider going "list only" to get things under control. It's only fair that the people who helped you build your folder will continue to have access to your now impressive collection. Even if you don't go list only you can still offer extra download slots for the users on your list as a way of returning the favor.

10) If you found this helpful either as a new user, or as a timesaver in helping others, spread it around. And of course, you can always add me to your list too.

DanteAmor
--
Maui, Hawaii
1/9/06

[radfaraf]

Hoooray for newbies with good ideas. :B

[brickcitykid]

thx for that, cleared up and pinned.

[replicant]

First a disclaimer... I don't claim to be an expert on this subject by any means.

In fact, I'm a fairly new user and had to pick up most of these details through trial and error, a good number of bans myself, and finally through conversations with a few generous power users.

I finally got tired of typing the same thing over and over again so I pasted the following into my user info earlier today, and have already gotten messages from new users thanking me.

Feel free to add other tips and comments that could be helpful, and perhaps the admin will thumbtack this so we can all just link people to it when they need a clue.

----------------------

Newbie Guide to Soulseek Etiquette

So here's the deal if you want to keep from being banned by others...

1) Only download 1-2 albums at a time from each user, and always read user info. Some people have quirky rules. 1 album (or 10 individual files) is pretty much always safe, two is fine with most but not all, and if you want more than that be sure to ask first.

2) Keep your folder organized. Take note of how other users with big folders do this and copy the style that makes the most sense for you. Many will ban just for having disorganized shares. Doesn't matter how small your folder is now, start organizing right from the start. You'll be amazed at how quickly it can get out of control.

3) Especially when you're new and under 1000 files, add *everything* you download to your share folder and update right away as soon as the d'ls complete. The sooner you get to 3-500 files, the sooner you'll stop seeing "banned" coming up.

4) Even if you only want to add a few songs to your player, keep the full album in your shares. Most people only want complete albums.

5) Don't ask people to start your download. It's not fair to those that have been waiting even longer than you, and some will ban just for that. If you can't stand waiting, support soulseek and drop a measly 5 bucks for privileges.

6) Don't delete the extra files like .nfo, .sfv, and album art. Even if you don't use them, many serious users are only looking for folders that are complete with these. (they allow users to identify and confirm the quality of a download)

7) Avoid sharing your iTunes folder. iTunes renames and changes the tags of your files which really pisses off a lot of serious traders. Better to keep a separate share folder and then import to iTunes from there. This maintains the integrity of the original files and folders.

8) The best way to build up your folder in the beginning without getting banned is to simply ask first. Let people know you're new, and that you'll be adding everything to your shares as soon as you've finished downloading. Many will be generous and helpful as long as you're sincere and can show you're not just a "leech".

9) Lastly, get into the habit of adding every person you download from to your user list. Before you know it you may find that people are piling up in your queue and you're having to consider going "list only" to get things under control. It's only fair that the people who helped you build your folder will continue to have access to your now impressive collection. Even if you don't go list only you can still offer extra download slots for the users on your list as a way of returning the favor.

10) If you found this helpful either as a new user, or as a timesaver in helping others, spread it around. And of course, you can always add me to your list too.

DanteAmor
--
Maui, Hawaii
1/9/06

Thanks, DanteAmor for the No-Nonsense set of polite rules. As yet it has been a mystery why I had been getting 'Banned'... All of this makes sense now. I'll add you to my list first.

Replicant

[babylove]

Thanks will add you to my list you will be my first as soon as I can figure out how to get in and see some music that people are willing to share dont have a clue yet but will keep on reading and thanks very helpful.

[ashachickdahler]

hi everyone, i am obviously another newby, with a ton of questions, but you pretty well answered most of what i had wanted to ask...yay for you!!! now off i go to search for the answers to my other questions......any idea which way i should go???

P.S. I apologise for not quoting the original post, but it just made my reply so lonnnnnnngggggggggggggggg..and to anyone i have gotten tunes off....THANK YOU!!! I have added you ALL to my list ...cheers!!!

Edited by asha, 29 January 2006 - 09:20 AM.

[gonzo187]

hi everyone, i am obviously another newby, with a ton of questions, but you pretty well answered most of what i had wanted to ask...yay for you!!! now off i go to search for the answers to my other questions......any idea which way i should go???

P.S. I apologise for not quoting the original post, but it just made my reply so lonnnnnnngggggggggggggggg..and to anyone i have gotten tunes off....THANK YOU!!! I have added you ALL to my list ...cheers!!!

gonna sound so dumb, but i load the program and it asks for username and pass ???
then it says could not resolve web adress or summet silly

[proccy]

you can make up your username and password on the spot gonzo

[ehenocka]

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but I've had soulseek for a number of years now and in my experience not all of that is right.

First off, in the course of that time I have changed computers and have never had more than 500 songs. This has never gotten me banned. Secondly, I only keep the songs from an album that I like. This has never gotten me banned. Lastly, I let iTunes organize my music. This too has not gotten me banned.

My tips against banning are as follows; 1) Make sure you share your music, it's not fair if you don't contribute! 2) Never download too much from one user. 3) Never select "download file containing folder." True that may only contain the album, but as I soon learned, it could contain EVERYTHING, causing an obvious ban. Simply hold down shift to select multiple items.

I have gotten banned only a few times (4 at the most). I recall getting banned once because I was unwittingly not sharing, and another time for accidentally downloading too much. I apologized to the users, fixed my preferences or my transfers, and had my sentence revoked.

It's that simple!
(b~_^)b

[DanteAmor]

Thanks for sharing your own differing perspective. Everyone can benefit from a broader base of experience.

There is no "right" or "wrong" in these matters. We're a community with as many perspectives as there are users.

That said, every single point made in the original post is based entirely on real world experiences (and bans), actual conversations with generous power users (20,000+ files in shared folder), and countless instances of nearly identical rule lists found in the user info pages of heavy slsk players.

It's not meant to be exhaustive or definitive. Heck, there are users that will ban simply because they don't like your TASTE in music.

If you've never had more than 500 files in your iTunes after a number of years then you're a casual trader at best and can certainly get by with simply being polite and not being greedy.

Users that are more heavily active though will come up against virtually every point above sooner or later, especially if they are wanting to gain access to the enormous resources of those slsk users with the deepest libraries of shares. (many of whom are list only and won't even let you play in their sandbox with less than 5-10,000 shares)

These weren't offered as universal commandments, they don't reflect all (or even most) user's rules, and I don't even agree with many of the points personally. Even so, they are a reflection of the "culture" of many of soulseek's most serious traders and understanding these points is useful... even if you don't choose to adopt them personally.

Take what you like, and leave the rest. As with most anything, your mileage may vary.

All The Best,
DanteAmor
--
Maui, Hawaii

[Lycanthropos]

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but I've had soulseek for a number of years now and in my experience not all of that is right.

First off, in the course of that time I have changed computers and have never had more than 500 songs. This has never gotten me banned. Secondly, I only keep the songs from an album that I like. This has never gotten me banned. Lastly, I let iTunes organize my music. This too has not gotten me banned.

My tips against banning are as follows; 1) Make sure you share your music, it's not fair if you don't contribute! 2) Never download too much from one user. 3) Never select "download file containing folder." True that may only contain the album, but as I soon learned, it could contain EVERYTHING, causing an obvious ban. Simply hold down shift to select multiple items.

I have gotten banned only a few times (4 at the most). I recall getting banned once because I was unwittingly not sharing, and another time for accidentally downloading too much. I apologized to the users, fixed my preferences or my transfers, and had my sentence revoked.

It's that simple!
(b~_^)b

Uhmm... number 3 shouldn't affect anyone who takes the time to look what's in the folder first (it's pretty easy to tell and just as easy to double check). I had this problem once though when a user had a zip of the album in their main shared folder. The album and the zip were next to each other on the search. I clicked the wrong one...


Thank you, DanteAmor for this! I didn't know the itunes thing but I don't use it, now I will choose elsewhere if I get the option in a search.

Your guide is my new user info and I added you.

[DanteAmor]

Glad that you found it helpful, and thanks for adding me!

A few tips for iTunes users...

I actually still use iTunes because I haven't found another player for Mac that offers as good a mix of usability and features.

I just don't let it organize my collection.

Anyone that wants to do the same should go into the preferences and de-select "keep iTunes music organized" and "copy files to iTunes music folder when adding to library".

Then you can keep your collection anywhere you like and just select it under "iTunes music folder location".

This will keep iTunes from reformatting the tags and folder names.

It will also keep "iTunes" from showing in your folder tree when those few users that are uptight about such things decide to browse your collection.

Keep Sharing!
Dante

[alf.]

Maui, Hawaii. Wow, I don't think I'd use a computer if I lived over there.

[BanYoMan]

lol alf

good initiative DanteAmor!
you're added :-D

[Dizos]

7) Avoid sharing your iTunes folder. iTunes renames and changes the tags of your files which really pisses off a lot of serious traders. Better to keep a separate share folder and then import to iTunes from there. This maintains the integrity of the original files and folders.

What is the proper organizational structure? My iTunes seems well organized by musician/album/track.

[DanteAmor]

What is the proper organizational structure? My iTunes seems well organized by musician/album/track.

It's not just a matter of organization, iTunes can also change the actual file names without asking.

iTunes does do a great job of organizing, it just does it in a way that isn't helpful to file sharing.

First of all it strips out the file and folder names of "scene release" albums which contain info that is there specifically to help the P2P community. Details like who encoded it and how are signals of quality which many people use to decide which version of an album to download. This (combined with SFV files) is done to keep the integrity of an album intact after countless generations of transfers.

Also you'll notice that virtually all scene releases put the tracks in a single folder listing both Artist and Album. This helps keep albums from being "orphaned" with no artist name attached. Many include both artist and track title in each mp3 file name for the same reason.

Using iTunes without custom configuration can strip and/or corrupt all of this important information. Anything that changes the identifying info provided by the original encoder causes problems for the entire community. Remember P2P is "viral". Any change made to the files and folders on your computer is then propagated every time you share.

I've often downloaded a half dozen different versions of a glitchy song trying to find a clean copy because of the same file had been renamed so many times.

My personal solution is only allowing iTunes to organize loose songs since most "heavy" traders are generally concerned with full albums. I import loose tracks directly into my iTunes folder but have iTunes play my full albums from a separate share folder keeping all of the folder and file names intact. To do this I de-select "copy files to iTunes library when importing" whenever I add full albums from this dedicated folder.

Hope this helps,
Dante
--
Maui, Hawaii

P.S. Alf, of course I use a computer here... music just sounds better under swaying palm trees.

[urmuthasacrakhed]

Also, im not sure if anyone has meansioned this yet, but - SHARE YOUR FILES!! that is the only reason i ban people, because they want to download off me but dont want to give anything back, which i personally feel is a bit cheaky.

[davepx]

Also, im not sure if anyone has meansioned this yet, but - SHARE YOUR FILES!! that is the only reason i ban people, because they want to download off me but dont want to give anything back, which i personally feel is a bit cheaky.

Yes indeed. I guess the idea was that newbies might not have much to share. In that case I recommend searching the Web for mp3s by acts you like - who knows, you may even track down something others haven't found yet. There really is a lot out there, and it's often only up for a couple of weeks, then pfft... it's gone!

I'd disagree with the emphasis put at the start of the thread on whole albums. Personally I'd far rather see a few odd rare B-sides, unreleased demo tracks and the like than gigabytes of standard official LP tosh. I think Slsk is big enough to have people doing things in different ways so long as we play fair, and it's more fun if we don't all just have the same stuff!

[cagee]

Also, im not sure if anyone has meansioned this yet, but - SHARE YOUR FILES!! that is the only reason i ban people, because they want to download off me but dont want to give anything back, which i personally feel is a bit cheaky.

Yes indeed. I guess the idea was that newbies might not have much to share. In that case I recommend searching the Web for mp3s by acts you like - who knows, you may even track down something others haven't found yet. There really is a lot out there, and it's often only up for a couple of weeks, then pfft... it's gone!

I'd disagree with the emphasis put at the start of the thread on whole albums. Personally I'd far rather see a few odd rare B-sides, unreleased demo tracks and the like than gigabytes of standard official LP tosh. I think Slsk is big enough to have people doing things in different ways so long as we play fair, and it's more fun if we don't all just have the same stuff!

thanks for the redirection to this trread someone back at the begin said it was pinned were is it pinned there is such a lack of common knowledge without having to ask

[happydravya]

Well, this explains a few things! I have been banned a few times for downloading too many albums from the same user.

My only question is why? As far as I'm concerned, it's a first come, first served game. I have never made any stipulations for those that download from me. I get in queue, wait in line, and expect the same from whoever wants to upload my files. Why should it matter how much anyone takes? Sometimes, I am looking for several albums from the same artist, and only 1 user comes up in my search that has them all. I guess I just don't see what the big deal is.

Also, I let itunes organize my files. If I didn't, I don't know how I would keep track of them all! If a file I download has incomplete or incorrect information, I eventually get around to updating it (I like to use allmusic.com to do the research) I have spent literally days cleaning up and organizing my files sometimes.

I used to be an avid vinyl collector. I got started in the early 90's because records were cheap and easy to come by. I got out of it when everyone started getting elitist and prices went up. I was suprised to find that some file sharers are as picky as vinyl collectors.

I must admit though, I am very pleased with soulseek. I started on napster back in 2000, and have tried morpheus, emule, bearshare, ares, acquisition, bittorrent, kazaa, limeware, and winmx since then. Right now, this is the best one out there.